Skip to the main content.
icon-visit-community About the Solopreneur Community

See what it's about.

icon-visit-community Go to The Solopreneur Community

Join the rest of the crew on Facebook.

Directory Solopreneurs Directory

Find solopreneurs to help you with your business.

SoloSuite Starter


SoloSuite Starter

FREE for all aspiring and established solopreneurs

SoloSuite Mastery Icon


SoloSuite Mastery

For those just beginning their solopreneur journey

SoloSuite Pro Icon


SoloSuite Pro

For established solopreneurs

Compare SoloSuites Icon


Compare SoloSuites

Explore our different packages

All LifeStarr Products


All LifeStarr Products

See our extensive list of solopreneur products

LifeStarr Courses


LifeStarr Solopreneur Courses

See our ever-growing list of courses

icon-meet-the-team Meet the Team

Get to know the crew behind LifeStarr.

icon-meet-the-team Who Is LifeStarr For?

We're not for everyone. Check out who we're helping.

icon-contact-us Contact Us

We'd love to hear from you!

icon-blog Solopreneur Success Secrets Blog

From information to inspiration

SSC_Icon The Solopreneur Success Cycle

Starting, Running, and Growing Your Company of One.

Checklist SSC Checklist

The Solopreneur Success Cycle Step-By-Step

icon-podcast Solopreneur Guide

Do you find yourself daydreaming more than 'daydoing'?




Check out what we’re up to

28 min read

Our Guest Sold $100M+ Worth of Products Using Email - Here’s How

sell millions using email marketing


Watch the Episode on YouTube

In this episode, we have an in-depth and unique discussion about email marketing with a true master in the field, Chris Orzechowski.

As the title suggests, Chris has amassed a staggering $100 million+ in sales for various products through email marketing, and he unveils the secrets behind why focusing on growing your email list is the real game-changer for solopreneurs.

In a world obsessed with social media, discover why cultivating a robust email community can be far more impactful for your business. 

Skeptics argue that email marketing isn't worth the effort for their small business but Chris tackles this head-on, unraveling the truth about whether it's a strategic fit for everyone.

Gain invaluable insights into the proven tactics and best practices solopreneurs can employ to create an email list that's not just large but genuinely engaged.

From avoiding common pitfalls to crafting emails that resonate, this episode is a goldmine of actionable advice for solopreneurs seeking to elevate their email marketing game.

And here's the clincher – discover how crafting compelling emails isn't just about engagement; it's a direct route to putting more money in your pocket. 

Be sure to check it out!

Connect with Chris Orzechowski

Favorite Quote About Success:

Never interrupt an enemy when he's making a mistake." - Napoleon Bonaparte


Going solo in business doesn't mean you're alone! Join our thriving Facebook community group exclusively designed for solopreneurs!  Connect with like-minded individuals who understand the unique challenges and triumphs of running a business single-handedly. Gain valuable insights, discover proven strategies, and unlock the power of networking as you engage in lively discussions and receive expert advice. We hope to see you there!

About Chris Orzechowski

Chris Orzechowski (dubbed by Forbes as the $100M Copywriter) was a struggling public school teacher who decided to go all in on his freelance copywriting business at the age of 23. Over ten years later, Chris has earned over $120M for his clients using email marketing and is one of the most sought-after experts in copywriting, marketing, and brand growth today.

Chris has worked with over 200 brands (including Carnivore Snax, Gold Medal Wine Club, Terrasoul Superfoods, Factor 75, NeuroGym's John Assaraf, Robert Kiyosaki of "Rich Dad Poor Dad,” and more), he has trained 5,000 students through his courses, and he is the author of his upcoming book, The M.O.A.T. — Scale your ecommerce brand to 8-figures (and beyond) without going insane or going broke [Oct. 2023].

Chris is the CEO and Founder of the 100 Year Brand, The Email Copywriter and Orzy Media.

He has been featured in Forbes, Business Insider here and hereThe Ecommerce Influence podcastConscious Millionaire podcastCopy Chief RadioMindset First podcast, High Income Business Writing podcastThe Entrepreneurs Ecosystem podcast, and more.

Like this show? Click on over and give us a review on Apple Podcasts Thanks!

Full Episode Transcript

Chris Orzechowski (00:00):

Email is important because it's an asset that you own. You could take your email list with you. If you want to move to a different email software, you can't export your Instagram followers, you can't export your Facebook followers, you can't export your TikTok audience.

Intro (00:16):

Welcome to the One-Person business podcast, the show for solopreneurs, consultants and contractors who are ready to take charge of their business and reclaim their freedom. Join us as we bring you inspiring stories, invaluable insights and practical strategies from successful solopreneurs and industry experts empowering you to create its lagging business that aligns with your unique goals and allows you to live life on your own terms. Here are your hosts, Joe Rando and Carly Ries.

Carly Ries (00:46):

Welcome to the One-Person Business podcast. I'm one of your hosts, Carly Ries.

Joe Rando (00:50):

And I'm Joe Rando.

Carly Ries (00:52):

Joe, in recent episodes, we've talked a lot about social media marketing and how we don't love social media marketing and just what solopreneurs should really be focusing on to help grow their business. Something we haven't really dabbled on, which you and I love and which we use so much in Lifestarr are emails, email marketing. I know people are like, oh, well, I get flooded with emails in my inbox. But, it's because they work, and that's a good way to reach out to your community to get the message out. So we were like, why don't we actually cover this topic? We haven't yet. It is so important and we've seen so many benefits from it. So we have on the show today, Chris Orzechowski. He is kind of like an email wizard and we want him to share everything. He wasn't always that way and that's what I'm so excited for this. I think people get intimidated by writing effective emails. I know, Chris, you had to work on your craft and we'll get to that story and everything. So, even if you don't think this is going to be a strong skillset for you, it absolutely can be and it can work wonders for your business. So Chris, with that being said, welcome to the show.

Chris Orzechowski (01:57):

Thanks so much for having me. I'm excited to be here.

Carly Ries (02:00):

This'll be great. When we were prepping for the show, you have very interesting story. You are just like, oh, I'm going to be a writer and I'm going to make millions and millions of dollars for these companies. You actually started off as a teacher, if I'm not mistaken. Then you dove into the world of solopreneurship and now you are where you are today. Can you tell us your full story, and how you ended up here?

Chris Orzechowski (02:31):

Yeah, so I was a public school teacher. I taught special ed. I taught elementary school third, fourth and fifth, writing and math. Two years after that, I taught eighth grade special ed math. And when I was in college, everyone was picking their majors and figuring out what they wanted to do. I'm like, I don't really want to do anything to be honest with you. I always joked around in high school, "I want to make a lot of money, but not doing a whole lot of stuff", which obviously isn't a job unless you're a successful investor, in which case the whole goal was to just sit on your hands and do nothing and wait for the right opportunity. But I didn't know what I wanted to do . I was a wrestler and I wanted to keep coaching.


So I was like, I guess I could be a school teacher and coach. It was very hard to get a job when I was getting out. It'd be 500 plus people applying for a single teaching job. It was almost impossible. But I was a male, special ed certified, which is like finding a needle in a haystack. In my cohort in college, it was all women and then myself. So I got a job like that. It was great. So I figured out how to get in. I got the job, but as soon as I started working, it just wasn't what I thought it was going to be, and I really didn't love it. I don't know what I want to do, but I knew that people made money on the internet, and this is back in 2013. I was like, "how does that whole thing work? How do you make money on the internet? What is this?" I knew a few people who, one of my early mentors, his name was Zach, he was a strength coach that I worked for, and he would sell eBooks and do all these things. I was like, that's so cool. It's a digital download and you're getting cash for it. This is crazy. I was just enamored by that whole thing. I wound up tumbling down the rabbit hole, starting a bunch of different blogs and things and just learning the ins and outs. I had to learn how to do a WordPress site and learn how to use Optimized Press and all these tools and everything. I had a couple of sites that did decent, but I didn't really make a lot of money. But then I discovered the thing that I was doing every day, writing copy.


I had an email list and I was writing emails every day and blog posts, and I was like, oh, there's this thing called copywriting where you could actually get paid. People pay you a lot of money if your copy's good and they run it and they make a lot of money. They make a lot of sales from campaigns you create. I always loved writing. In college, I would always try to take classes where I could write a paper instead of taking an exam. I was good at the exams too, but the writing was fun. It was like you'd be at the computer lab, you'd be on your seventh Red Bull at three in the morning and you'd just be cranking out words and listening to music. So I was like, how do I just do more of that? And that's what led me down the rabbit hole initially. So I taught for four years, and during those four years I worked every single day on building up my writing business. Then eventually got to the point where I was making more as a writer, working part-time doing that, than I was at the teaching job, which as a teacher, I only had to make more than $54,000 a year. So it wasn't like some people, they're like, "yeah, I had a $300,000 tech job."


That's a total order to replace that. But I was like, Hey, I could do 5K a month. So that's what I did. Then June 16th, 2017, that was my last day. I quit and I went full-time.

Carly Ries (05:49):

I love this story. I think that's so funny that you shed light on like, oh, I just had to make that much. But what's interesting to me is you said you loved writing in college. You also said you worked hard at building your writing business. Did writing come naturally to you, or did you really have to work on that craft?

Chris Orzechowski (06:06):

I think it came naturally to me, it definitely did. I don't like to gloss over this because some people are just good at certain things. I'm not good at everything. I'm definitely not good at everything. But one thing I am good at is writing. My dad did this big project where he traced our family lineage back and we were able to track the Orzechowski name back into the 1500s and there's this very famous guy who was this big writer back then. I always like to joke around and be like, oh, it's in my DNA, it's in my blood. I have the writing in my blood. But it always just came naturally to me. Even in college, sometimes when we'd have parties, back when you used Facebook invites, we'd be drinking and then I'd get on the computer and start writing these elaborate invites and people would laugh. I'd make a lot of jokes and things, and people loved them. So I always felt like I had it there. I don't know if I necessarily knew how good I could be at it, but I had kind of an inclination towards it. I enjoyed it. I guess the way my brain works, I just think in writing. A lot of times I'll write to help me clarify my thoughts. I have these ideas, but I just need to get 'em out. So I'll start writing and then I'll be like, "oh, that's what I was trying to say."

Carly Ries (07:25):

So I want to ask you some questions. It sounds like it comes naturally to you, but for a lot of one person business owners, that isn't their skillset. They have the reason they started their business, but marketing may not be that easy for them. Writing may not be that easy for them. So let's start honing in on email marketing specifically since it's kind of what you're known for. You've sold over a hundred million worth of products for your clients, which is kind of a big deal. Why should people be focusing on growing their email list instead of maybe their social media audience, working on their website constantly? What is it about email specifically, and where does finding a niche play into all of that?

Chris Orzechowski (08:06):

Email is important because it's an asset that you own. You could take your email list with you. If you want to move to a different email software, you can't export your Instagram followers, you can't export your Facebook followers, you can't export your TikTok audience. You know what I mean? And that's the biggest thing because what happens, whatever social platform is, there's like a startup idea. When these companies start up, and you saw this with not a great example, but Clubhouse. Eventually they got everyone on the platform and they were going to plan to monetize it afterwards. But you see this with every platform where like Facebook, if you remember a decade ago, they were getting people on the platform, they were giving you insane reach so you can make a post and 80% of your followers, your 10,000 followers and 8,000 people would see your post.


Now you make a post on your business page and 1% of people see it if you're even lucky. What happens is the platforms want to get you on, so they kind of hook you. It's like with the dopamine hits of like, oh, I'm posting all this content. You're getting people onto the platform, and then they pull that away. They pull the rug out from under you and say, now you have to pay for the reach with ads, which is understandable. They're in business, they need to make money. But with email, if you have a 40 or 50% open rate, then you're reaching 40 to 50% of your people every time you send an email. And it's not always the same 40 ur 50%. So you might be able to reach an even larger percentage of your audience, maybe 40% of people who open this email.


It's not the exact same. Maybe there are other people who didn't open that first one and the second one. So you could reach a much larger percentage of your audience with email because it's the asset. You own the distribution list better. It's really not that different. People are very intimidated by email, but then they'll post on social. They'll create content every day and it's great content, but they just don't get the reach out of it, and they don't make any money because of the distribution level. You're not getting the same distribution, the same reach, because again, you're renting land on someone else's platform instead of owning your own platform. That's where email is super important. Like I said, you own the asset. That list, if you start on another social platform, you're not starting zero followers anymore. Let's say a new social platform comes out tomorrow, you email your list, tell 'em they're around this platform, and then those people will follow you there.


So that's an asset that you own. It's an asset you can continue to monetize. And the important stuff in people's lives comes to their email inbox. As long as they're sending receipts and shipping notifications and password reset instructions to your inbox, that's where people are going to go back for what the important things to life. So by you being someone who they say, I want to hear more from this person and I'm going to sign up for their list, that's a very important relationship. Email is private and intimate.

Joe Rando (10:41):

Everything you're saying is so spot on. I know so many people that had huge followings on some social platform and then got shut down for no apparent eason. They either got hacked or even they didn't get hacked, but just for some reason they shut 'em down because they said they violated some policy. There's nobody to talk to. It's crazy. So yeah, I totally agree with you. If you don't have an email address, you don't really have an asset.

Chris Orzechowski (11:08):

Just to add to that, literally no reason sometimes. Sometimes people say inflammatory things or whatever, and that'll happen. That definitely happens. But I was looking one time with some e-comm brand owner. He had a business he was advertising on Google, and they shut him down. No explanation. There was no recourse for him. He sold baby clothing. It's not some gray market, like, is this legal? It was the most boring above board business you could imagine and was shut down for. And that happens all the time, for no reason at all. I'm not anti-social media because I think social media is exceptional for acquisition and for generating ideas and networking especially. That's where it's super important. And for ads. I love ads. I run ads all the time, my clients run ads. Super important. But you've got to know what tool is required for the job. Social media is for your acquisition, and then monetization and profitability and long-term revenue potential is from the people on the list

Carly Ries (12:07):

Is email marketing for everybody. We have some solopreneurs who are like, I just need three or four clients at a time to make my business sustainable and to make my business work for me. I would argue that it's still important, but I want to hear your thoughts on that. For us, our newsletters, our event email, everything we do, we're speaking to a really large list so it makes sense. But if you don't need that many clients, what's your take on that?

Chris Orzechowski (12:37):

Every client you have is going to leave you at some point. So what's the plan to replenish them? You can work with a client for 10 years, but that's a universal truth. You can work with a client for 60 years. At some point you're going to die or they're going to die, or they're going to move on, or you're going to move on. Or the dynamics change.


You're going to lose every client that you ever have, and that's okay. That's just the nature of client services. It just depends on how deep do you want your wait list to be. For me, I'm going to be in business for a long time, so I want a deep wait list. I want a line of people around the block. That's where the list comes in. I know that if I have more demand than I have supply, things are always going to be in my favor. That's why I think the list is important. Do you need it? No. I know people who just do social and that's fine. There's this fitness coach that I know who has 250,000 followers. His Instagram got hacked, like you guys were just saying before, and he had to go to a backup account.


He has a list too, but he doesn't really mail it. So again, in those situations, having the asset that you own is the most important thing. Owning that first party data that you have, super important. You know you don't need it, but why wouldn't you want it? One of my clients yesterday, she owns an e-commerce brand. She sent an email and within two hours she made $12,000. I hit her up because it's been about 24 hours since she sent it, and she just made additional $3,000 since we last spoke, and the email took her 10 minutes to write. So it's like she made $1,500 a minute. So no, you don't need to do it, but why wouldn't you want to do it? That's always my challenge to people.

Carly Ries (14:14):

That's a great point. So she just made a lot of money because she sent out her list. Let's start from there. How would a person go about building their list?

Chris Orzechowski (14:26):

My favorite preferred way is ads. Not everyone starts here though, because obviously if you're starting out and you have one or two clients, cashflow is important. Ads take money because you have to learn about what your funnel is. And I'm not going to gloss over that. It's a more advanced thing for a lot of people, but I think it ads are the best because you can use the pixel and you can use the algorithm to essentially say, Hey, Facebook or Instagram or whoever, find me more people like this. And it will go do that because it's the best, most advanced advertising system in the world. It knows who your people are. It'll find them as long as you have the right offer and you put the right worm on the hook to catch the right kind of fish you want. But before you get to that stage, I think the social content's great.


What I like to do is, when I was starting out, I would just make a post on social. I would call this a lead magnet test where essentially you just say, Hey, I'm thinking about creating this thing. The first one I ever did was the seven laws of email copywriting, and this is years ago. I said, "I'm putting the finishing touches on this thing. If you're interested in it, comment the word email on this post and I'll grab your email and I'll send it to you when it's ready." I got like 50 something people respond on that. I didn't even create the thing at that time. I just was testing out the idea. But again, they don't know. It doesn't matter if it's done or not. People commented, I wouldn't have wasted time to grade it, but I put that post out.


What's cool is as people are starting to comment on the post, that tells the social media algorithm that wow, this post is really popular. We should push this out to more people. And you've seen this before. "Hey, my friend just commented on this thing from this person, I don't know what is this about" Then you click over and you see maybe you're interested in that too. It's kind of a snowball effect. So that's what I started doing initially. My list was like 55 people for months, and I was emailing and thinking I'm not really making any money. I have 55 people. I didn't really have offers either, but I said, how do I really start growing this? So that was one of the first things I did, and it jumped from 55 to 120. Okay, so I did it another couple of times, I get to 200, 300, 400, and now we have some momentum. Now I had a feedback loop with the audience. I could say, "what else do you need help with? What kind of content should I create?" That feedback loop is what instructed me to create more content to attract the right kind of people. And that just tends to grow and grow over time. It's kind of like this flywheel effect. You build by having that dialogue with your audience.

Carly Ries (16:42):

So you're talking about creating content. You keep saying, "that's how money ended up in my pocket". So much content these days is free. How does creating the content lead to dollars in a person's pocket specifically from email?

Chris Orzechowski (16:58):

The value in content is the unique insight that you give that no one else can give. You're not the only person teaching what you teach. Honestly, someone could type in how do you do X, Y, Z into chat GPT and four seconds they have a list of steps. But it's not about bad, it's about context. That's where good content is. Good content is context dependent. You see this all the time. You'll see Grant Cardone, they'll post this thing about this nine figure strategy and blah, blah, blah. That's cool, but that's not really for you. Yeah, there might be some useful application. It doesn't mean it's bad advice, it just means it might not be the right piece of advice for you at this given time in your life. So when we talk about context, your coaching programs, your services, your courses, your e-commerce products, it's not for everyone.


You have to first determine who are the people that my stuff is for, and then how do I make the content aligned with the context for what my people need to hear? That's the big difference. The value is not in the stuff that you teach, but it's in unique insight perspective that you bring based on what you've done, and you are on unique system and proprietary ways of solving that person's problems. That's really what it comes down to. The other part of it is certain people are going to like you and certain people aren't going to like you, and that's okay. You don't want to be vanilla. Vanilla is vanilla. Some people like vanilla, but no one's going to brag on Instagram that they had vanilla ice cream. They're going to rag about this insane flavor with this triple chocolate with peanut butter, blah, blah. That's the difference.

Joe Rando (18:35):

I would argue you're better off being mushroom flavored ice cream than vanilla these days.

Chris Orzechowski (18:38):

That'll go viral, exactly. That's what I mean. You're not going to be the only person ever teaching what you teach, but that's okay because certain people will align with you who don't align with other people. For example, when I post content, sometimes I'll tell stories about when I was a college wrestler and there are people who are like, "oh, I do BJJ, I didn't know you wrestled". There's a resonance between us because we have that shared bonding experience. Or other people are like, Hey, I played baseball in college, or I played soccer, or whatever. It's like the college athlete, we align on those. This person is kind of like me and now I have an affinity for them. So the content is how you get some of those facts out about your life, which gets certain people to like you. Because again, if you don't share any of that, and people are like, why should I trust you? Why should I like you? How are you different? You're just some person on my screen and why should I care? But if you see, oh, wow, this person just like me, they walked on a similar journey, a similar path that I'm trying to walk on, then that's where you capture a lot of interest and attention and loyalty.

Carly Ries (19:36):

So just to clarify, you are not charging for this content. You are just building up ways for people to know trust and you so that when they go to your site, they're more likely to purchase your services. It's not that you're charging for the content, you're just building that relationship with the content and the people will be like, "oh, well, I want to work with this person".,

Chris Orzechowski (19:55):

Yeah, exactly. A lot of what I do is just sharing stories of me, my work with clients or stories of my life that are demonstrative of the thing I'm trying to sell. And then you have the paid offers for if you want my help doing this thing, solving this problem in your life, I have this program that is designed to do that. That's the next step. Then they have to cross the chasm. They have to decide, okay, I want to enroll on this journey with this person. A lot of it's demonstration on the front end and it is salesmanship. It might be more content heavy rather than copy heavy, although I think they are at its core the same thing, just different styles of execution. But it's what gets attention and gets people to say, "oh, I kind of like this person. This person's interesting.


I want to learn more about them because they're like me or because I dig what they're saying". Then once they're in your world and you capture their attention, then you can move them to the next level. Again, nothing really changes in their life until they make a buying decision. People commit with their credit cards. They commit to making a change in their own lives when they say, I give you all the content in the world. I mean, you tell someone, maybe it's a friend and you help 'em out for free and you say, do X, Y, Z, and they never do it. They haven't committed with their credit card yet. So the initial content is really just to maybe give them some initial wins or to get them to shift their beliefs and kind of align your world use. Then the paid stuff is when you hit the gas and actually make things happen in their life.

Joe Rando (21:16):

Chris, I'm going to argue that what you're doing in that first phase is building trust with them, that they're trusting you. Nobody turns over their credit card until they're sure they trust whoever it is they're dealing with. It sounds to me like that's exactly what you're doing, giving them good information and good content.

Chris Orzechowski (21:31):

When they see enough stuff, once you share the 147th success story, they're like, okay, this person knows what they're talking about. They've proved it. I believed them. Again, you probably had cold emails in your inbox and someone's like, I can get you this result. It's like, who are you? Maybe you can, maybe you can't, but I'm just going to send you $5,000. I met you five minutes ago, that's very hard to do.

Carly Ries (21:56):

I meant to ask you this earlier, but just since we're talking about credit cards, it made me think of payments again. When you run the ads to build the list, what do those ads say? Is it like I am Chris Orzechowski, join my email list? What are some effective copywriting tips for those?

Chris Orzechowski (22:16):

It depends on what your offer is. I've done some free funnels where it's like, Hey, I'm giving you this free template or training or webinar or whatever, which is going to teach them a bigger thing. I've also done book funnels for my own stuff where we're spending 9 or 10 grand a month on ads and recouping 80 to 100 percent of that on day zero, where you have an $8 book and then there's an order bump and an upseller two to get an average order value that's equivalent to what your cost per acquisition is. You can't put your whole intro and your whole resume into that ad, but it's like, "Hey, if you're suffering up from this problem, I created this thing. It's going to help you. In case you want to know who I am, here's who I am, here are the new things you need to know about me. If you have this problem, this thing will help you. Bullet, bullet, bullet: call to action, urgency or whatever.

Joe Rando (23:07):

Where is this ad? Is this a Facebook ad?

Chris Orzechowski (23:09):

I like doing Facebook ads. I think for most people, Facebook and Instagram is an easy way to start. I've done YouTube too. I've had clients who have done a lot of different networks, but I think Facebook and Insta, get started there. It's easy. It's proven. They have 2 billion people. They have your customers. They're there. There are 2 billion people there. They'll find 'em. I think that's the way to go initially. They don't have to be super long. Sometimes it's like, Hey, I'm giving away this book that does blah, blah, blah. And then when they read the book, they'll know more about you. Again, it's about what is the problem people have? You can call out the problem and offer the solution, then you're starting to build that bridge of trust.

Joe Rando (23:49):

So is this a video? Is this an ad with the video that people are watching?

Chris Orzechowski (23:53):

I've done videos.

Joe Rando (23:53):

It seems like you have a lot of content. It sounded like a lot of content for just words.

Chris Orzechowski (23:58):

I've done videos, I've done static images. The thing is when people are scrolling, they'll stop. They'll say, oh, what's this? I want this or I think I want this. It's like, Ooh, this pair of pants, that looks cool. What's this about? Oh, what's this brand? Let me click over and see what this is all about. And then they land on the page and they start to read more. Even if it's a book, it's like, what is this book about? I've never seen this book before. Wow, okay. It's a book that'll teach me X, Y, Z. I have this problem, let me investigate.


And they land on the page. Oh, here's the author. I've never heard of this person, but they've done X, Y, and Z. They've been in these outlets. Here are some clients they've worked with or whatever, or here's some testimonials. Again, you just need to capture the attention and the intent on the front end, and then you don't have to put everything. Some of these ads are 300 words. Some might be a hundred to 500 words, sometimes less. Just like, "Hey, I have this thing. I want to give it to you to help you solve this problem." And people who have that problem then they become, "oh, there's a solution for this. Okay, let me investigate this solution". And the cool thing is the algorithm will find those people.


It knows who's having what problems at what time. This is not really a new thing. Companies like Target, department stores, they've been doing this for decades now. There's this famous story how everyone thinks, oh, the data, they're mining our data. They've been mining our data forever. They've been mining data from 50, 60 years before the internet was even a big thing. There was a story, I think it was Target back maybe in the eighties where this girl was like 16. She started getting flyers and coupons for diapers and formula and all these things. And the dad was like, what is this? He stormed into Target and started yelling at the managers, why are you sending my daughter all these things about diapers and baby stuff? It turns out the girl was actually pregnant but the dad didn't know. But they just know based on your shopping behavior, and they have this data from all these public sources and now multiply that by a hundred with Facebook because they see everything you're clicking. They see what you're posting about, they see what you're liking, they see what videos you're viewing. So they take all of that stuff and say, we know who has certain problems. You've probably done this before. You click on one, oh, that's a nice sweater, and then you got a hundred ads for sweaters after that because the algorithm knows and it knows who has what problems. That's why it's useful for you because it can find the right kind of people for you.

Carly Ries (26:07):

Absolutely. That all makes sense from an ad standpoint. So I want to pivot. We were talking about best practices for ads, but what we want to talk about today are emails. At the beginning of this interview, you were saying if 50% of the people open your email, you're reaching 50% of your audience at minimum because it changes. Do you have any best practices for subject lines to increase that open rate for the emails themselves to increase that click through rate? The click through rate is arguably more important. What tips do you have for people that are new to email marketing or even new to just emailing clients and stuff. What tips do you have for them in the email itself?

Chris Orzechowski (26:55):

The way I think about it is I care about sales and really nothing else. I look at other markers to see if there's anything uncharacteristic. If I have a 50% open rate, then send an email I think gets 12%, I'm like, oh, what happened? But for the most part, as long as you're fine with deliverability, I don't worry about that stuff. What I think about with emails, if you're an influencer, people tune in influencers every day. They'll go on Instagram and it'll be like, oh, this person who is this dealer celebrity? And they post these stories and it's like me at the park with my kids, and it's like people get into this stuff and we all have people we like to follow for any number of reasons and in different domains, but that's what email is. It's the same thing. People think it's different. People think, oh, well, I write an email, I have to be corporate. I have to title case, my subject line. I need to make sure I'm very professional. NO! It's just you getting content out that you would do on any other social platform. If you like talking about memes, you can put memes in your emails. If you like telling stories from your life or what you did the last week with your kids and you get tie it into your sales message, I do that sometimes too.


It's like your own little TV show, but it's in print and it allows you to kind of unpack stories and use those stories as demonstration pieces for the concepts that you're trying to help people with.

Joe Rando (28:11):

I've got an email printed out on my desk. It was the one that Sam Parr sent when he first started the hustle. After you signed up, the subject line comes in, "Look what you did, you little jerk." from Home Alone.

Chris Orzechowski (28:28):

Yeah, but everyone's like "announcing a new product and our product line...", it's like, okay, that's a sales message. I referenced, when I made a meme, my new book that's coming out, and I had Patrick Bateman with the CD. I put a picture of my book on it and did these little Patrick Bateman quotes. Do you like Huey Lewis and the News?


And what does that have to do with anything? But you see that and it's like new product, 50% off. Update your terms and conditions. That's what all those subject lines say. You like Huey Lewis and the news? it's like, oh, that's American Psycho. I like that movie. Maybe you click through and then there's story and there's all these other things I need. So that's how I think about everything. That's how I think about email. I always try to make my emails sound like they're coming from a person rather than a corporation, and I'll have everything lowercase. I like to make it look different and stand out in the inbox. I always like to make it look like it's coming from a person. What would a friend send to you?

Joe Rando (29:27):

that is awesome.

Carly Ries (29:29):

That's a great takeaway. And Chris, you did a little shameless plug that you kind of snuck under the rug there


This ain't my first rodeo.


I'd be remiss if we didn't ask you about this new book that you have coming out very soon. Can you talk about it?

Chris Orzechowski (29:45):

Yeah. It's called The Moat. And the reason I called it that was because that's what we're all trying to do, right? Everyone's trying to build a moat around your business, your brand. So I said, let me write a book about that. It kind of hearkens back to what we said at the beginning. Everyone is teaching what you're teaching. Everyone's selling what you're selling. You have a thousand competitors, maybe 10,000 competitors. How do you differentiate yourself and build a system for your business that can help you multiply capital in cash positive way, whether it's through ads, or whether it's through all the marketing that you're doing so that you can grow so that you have margins, so that you have acquisition systems and retention systems. It really just unpacks all of that. It's like my complete system. I do a lot of fractional CMO work too.


I used to do a lot of email stuff. I had an email agency. Now I do more fractional CMO work where I'm looking at your entire brand's marketing and helping people grow that way. I just realized a lot of people need the same stuff and they don't have it in place. So this book essentially walks you through Moat stands for mission, offers, acquisition, traction. Those are the four letters in the moat. It kind of walks you through how to implement each one of those steps so that your brand can grow and you can create that flywheel where you're acquiring the right kind of customers. They've bought into the vision for what you have. You have the right front end offers and backend offers. Then you have traction to where you can keep acquiring them, keep monetizing them, and then scale up.

Carly Ries (30:59):

Very cool. Chris, if people are interested in reading this book, where can they find it and when?

Chris Orzechowski (31:08):

It's going to be on Amazon, and then Black Friday is when it officially goes live. is my website. I'll probably have a link to Amazon there where you can just go to Amazon.

Carly Ries (31:24):

Listeners, we're recording this on November 16th, 2023. So by the time this airs, the book will be available. So don't wait. Go get it, please. This has been such a fun episode. We ask all of our guests this, and since you help so many people find success through email marketing, we have to ask you what your favorite quote is about success.

Chris Orzechowski (31:50):

That's a tough one. My favorite quote about success is actually kind of an interesting one. I'd say it's from Napoleon Bonaparte, where he says, "never interrupt your enemy when he's making a mistake". And the reason why I like that quote and how it relates to success is that a lot of times when you're out there building your business, you see what other people are doing. Everyone always presents the best version or they present their wins. And the way the algorithms work is you just see win after win after win for these other people. And a lot of times you start to feel down about the work that you're doing. You feel bad about yourself, but you might not know what's going on behind that business. People might be bragging about things, but their life is an absolute dumpster fire, and maybe they're making mistakes, or maybe they're rolling out a new platform.


You think, should I do that too? Like, oh, they just got set up on YouTube, should I be doing that? Or they just got set up on this platform, they just launched this kind of product. But a lot of times, some of these initiatives fail that people do. By you going out and chasing what everyone else is doing, instead of staying focused and doubling down on what you do in your business that works, that makes your business grow and makes your business awesome, you don't want to interrupt your enemies when they're making a mistake. You don't want to point that out. You want to let them just continue to do what they're doing and keep your blinders on the focus on your own business. So it's a little bit of a weird one I know, but that's always what I think about. I just focus on myself and multiply my own capital because capital allocation is everything. When you get money in your business, what do you do with that money? How do you grow that money into more money? And that's what we're trying to do. That's what your job is as a founder. Even if you're a one person business, even if you have the zero team, you have money coming in, how do you continue to grow it and build the machine that you build and turn your own flywheel?

Carly Ries (33:24):

Absolutely. Well, Chris, thank you so much for coming on today. We'll include the links to your website and everything in our show notes.

Joe Rando (33:35):

I just want to say how awesome this was. This was such a great interview and such a great set of advice for solopreneurs, and I really appreciate it.

Chris Orzechowski (33:43):

Thank you. I appreciate you guys having me

Carly Ries (33:45):

Absolutely. And listeners, thank you so much for tuning in. We will see you next time on the One-Person Business podcast.

Closing (33:55):

You may be going solo in business, but that doesn't mean you're alone. In fact, millions of people are in your shoes running a one person business and figuring it out as they go. So why not connect with them and learn from each other's successes and failures? At Lifestarr, we're creating a one-person business community where you can go to meet and get advice from other solopreneurs. Be sure to join in on the conversations at